Talk:Louisiana Purchase
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Some websites list 825,000 sq. mi. and others 900,000 sq. mi. Anyone know which is more acurrate and why we list it as 800,000 sq. mi.? --rmhermen
- The Louisiana Territory included a good bit of territory that was claimed but not yet occupied or mapped. The exact boundries, especially in the north west, were rather vague. -- Infrogmation
I'm rather amazed that this article went for so long with the mistatement that New Orleans was not included in the Louisiana Purchase. -- Infrogmation 02:00 Jan 21, 2003 (UTC)
This is from November 30 and 1803. I'm not sure how to integrate it into this article:
- On November 30, 1803 at the Cabildo building in New Orleans, Spanish representatives Governor Manuel de Salcedo and the Marqués de Casa Calvo, officially transfered Louisiana Territory to French representative Prefect Pierre Clément de Laussat.
The odd thing is that, according to the above, the French sold the Louisiana Purchase to the US before France officially held the land! If this is true, please update this article, if it is not true or somehow wrong, then please fix November 30 and 1803. --mav 06:15, 1 Dec 2003 (UTC)
- Notice that the passage says 1803, not 1830. Someone probably transposed the dates. I'll remove it from 1830 and put it on 1803, which is the correct date for the transfer from Spain to France. - VerbalHerbal
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- Opps! That was me! :) I have fixed my first post to reflect my blunder. But my original question remains... --mav
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- The transfer to the French was signed on October 1, 1800, and the Spanish officials had been ordered by their king to hand the province over on October 15, 1802. However, France assumed control of the government in New Orleans only on November 30, 1803. On December 20, 1803, the French then transferred possession to the Americans. - Andre Engels 10:37, 28 Nov 2004 (UTC)
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Was it $15 million or $22.5 million? The article lists both.
Also it would be fantastic if someone could calculate the inflation-adjusted value in today's dollars, if such a calculation can be made. Tempshill 18:58, 20 Dec 2003 (UTC)
- For US$ before 1933, $20 = 1 ounce of gold. -- Infrogmation 19:42, 20 Dec 2003 (UTC)
- Current price of gold. As I write this, the cost of gold is almost exactly $410/ounce. Therefore, $15 million * (($410/ounce)/($20/ounce)) = $307.5 million. --Raul654 21:13, 24 Dec 2003 (UTC)
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Pierre Samuel du Pont de Nemours
I recently read a book; "The DuPonts, Portrait of a Dynasty", 1976, By Marc Duke, which stated that Pierre_Samuel_du_Pont_de_Nemours was engaging in informal diplomacy between France and the U.S. on the behalf of Jefferson. According to this book Pierre originated the idea of the Louisiana Purchase as a way to avoid impending conflict between Napoléon and the U.S. regarding New Orleans. It goes on to say that Pierre laid the groundwork for James Monroe prior to his trip to France. It also stated that neither DuPont or Jefferson would understand in their lifetime the magnitude of the land deal.
The book painted a very different picture than this article. Any comments? Pud 03:43, 28 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Some more facts from the book; Jefferson hated the idea of purchasing Louisiana, on a bunch of levels, when DuPont first suggested it. But he also knew from his spies that Napoleon had a Fleet ready to sail to occupy the Mississippi. So he instructed DuPont to impress on Napoleon and Tallyrand that occupying New Orleans would mean a U.S. alliance with Britain, and war with France. Jefferson chose Monroe because he was know to have no qualms about going to war with France, and his last diplomatic mission there had ended in a formal expulsion.
Pud 04:26, 28 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Cost of the Louisiana Purchase
This BLM document ACQUISITION OF THE PUBLIC DOMAIN, 1781-1867 states that the cost of the Louisiana Purchase was $23,213,568. Their source was: from U.S. Geological Survey, Boundaries, Area, Geographic Centers (Washington, D.C., U.S. Government Printing Office, 1939), pp. 249-251. The Avalon at Yale: Louisiana Purchase--First Convention document seems to suggest 60 million francs (FRANCS 60,000,000) aka eleven millions, two hundred and fifty thousand Dollars ($11,250,000) was the cost, but that does NOT include the six percent interest included in the installment plan of twice yearly payments of three hundred and thirty Seven thousand five hundred Dollars ($337,500) The Negotiation of The Louisiana Purchase suggests that the $15 million number is the result of the $11,250,000 cost of the land itself plus America's acquisition of the cost of American claims against the French, i.e. France was washing its hands of everybody; the cost of the claims was twenty million francs (FRANCS 20,000,000), or $3,747,268. And then there's this scary business The Dutch Bank Documents which I daren't decipher as a fuzzy. jengod 03:35, Sep 30, 2004 (UTC)
To Do
- I added TOC but the article really needs some re-organization.
- Last paragraph, dispute with Spain, how was it resolved, anyone know?
- Duk 16:06, 12 Oct 2004 (UTC)
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- (Done) Duk 17:11, 1 Dec 2004 (UTC)
- 2 was finally resolved by the Adams-Onís Treaty in 1819, though the U.S. had been forcefully annexing portions up to that time. I added a mention of this to the article. older≠wiser 16:19, Oct 12, 2004 (UTC)
nearly all of Oklahoma, Kansas?
Since the very first version of this article, it has said the Purchase included nearly all of Kansas, I never noticed that before until Mulad just edited it to read nearly all of Oklahoma, Kansas. Now looking at the map, I can't see that there is any portion of either Oklahoma or Kansas that is not included in the Purchase area. Can anyone shed light on this? older≠wiser 13:23, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)
- If I recall correctly, the Panhandle of Oklahoma and the southwestern corner of Kansas were originally part of the Republic of Texas. That'll need to be substantiated, though. - jredmond 16:06, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)
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- I tried to look into this a tiny bit. I think the confusion is over precisely where the western boundary was. I think the maps shown on this page are "optimistic" illustrations favoring the U.S., while Spain undoubtedly would have produced a very different map of the territory acquired by the U.S. in the Purchase. Essentially both claimed certaion portions and these disputed claims were not resolved until later treaties. I seem to recall seeing some maps that illustrated the disputed areas -- it's be nice if we could get a map that shows disputed areas (including West Florida as well as on the western boundary) with cross-hatch or something. older≠wiser 16:28, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)
Monroe's Expulsion
This article mentions that one reason Monroe's presence late in the negotiations was such a pointed issue is that he had been formally ordered out of France after his last diplomatic mission there. I am just curious if more information might be provided on this matter, either here or on Wikipedia's page for James Monroe. It's more a matter of curiosity, but my thanks to anyone who could provide details on the subject. Pellinore 01:33, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
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